Welcoming Cynthia Aks, DO to Riordan Clinic

Riordan Clinic [00:00:00]:
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Riordan Clinic [00:00:37]:
This is the Real Health Podcast brought to you by Riordan Clinic. Our mission is to bring you the latest information and top experts in functional and integrative medicine to help you make informed decisions on your path to real health.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:00:56]:
Welcome everyone. Hello everyone. This is Dr. Ron Hunninghake back with another episode of the Real Health Podcast. And it’s my pleasure today to introduce Dr. Cynthia Aks. I always want to say ask.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:01:08]:
Everybody does Aks.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:01:11]:
And so, Dr. Aks, can I call you Cynthia?

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:01:15]:
Of course, please.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:01:16]:
So you’re coming on to the Riordan Clinic team and we’re excited to have you. I’m sure our listeners are kind of interested in what your background is and why you were even interested in coming to Riordan Clinic.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:01:32]:
Well, I’m very happy to be here and be part of the team.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:01:37]:
My background is that I grew up in a medical family that was really. Both my parents were dedicated to making a difference, helping others and being of service. And at a very young age, I developed an intense curiosity about the functioning of the body. And that took me down my journey to become a critical care nurse and an osteopathic surgeon and then a dedicated breast surgeon. Throughout that journey, I was very curious as to why people got sick and why with the same diagnosis and the same treatment, some people had different experiences, short term, intermediate and long term. So that kind of spurred my interest in learning more about the mind, body connection, the interconnectedness of the planet and the universe and all these things that have led me to eventually be here. Yeah, I love to educate, inspire, motivate and support people on their health journey.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:02:40]:
And so that’s what attracted us to you. We saw that, I saw that in you, that you have this innate curiosity and this interest in being a co-learner, which is the term that Dr. Riordan came up with, which basically says that it’s not just I’m the doctor and you’re the patient and I’m going to fix you. It’s more like, hey, you’ve got a disease, a concern, and we’re going to try to figure it out together. Because as much as I might know as a doctor, I still don’t know all of the information about you. And so your input is just as important as my background. And together we, as co-learners, we’re going to get better results if we have this kind of a relationship.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:03:28]:
Absolutely. I love that term co-learner because it really is a collaboration. I always felt that my patients were the most important person in their care team. And what I started learning about myself, the difference between being a general surgeon and then working with breast cancer patients, high risk patients and their families.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:03:54]:
I really love that relationship. It’s a totally different relationship. And the needs of breast cancer patients were different than those having a gallbladder removed or an appendix removed. I think that my background in nursing helped me to appreciate that relationship on more than just the physical level.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:04:17]:
Yeah. So I’ve always felt that my relationship with patients was enhanced when I kind of like, and this is, Dr. Riordan actually told me one time, he says, walk that old saying, walk a mile in their shoes. If, if I could kind of put myself in their circumstance, listening carefully to whatever they’re sharing with me and then taking my medical knowledge and putting that together. The situation was what I call empowered. We had an empowerment at that point to where we could make more progress if we had that kind of dynamic relationship.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:04:54]:
Absolutely.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:04:57]:
It really takes a village to help people learn to heal and educate them and help supporting them on long term.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:05:08]:
Sustainable changes. So it’s not just treating or helping people get through treatment, but teaching them the value of really honoring what is necessary to, to optimize their wellness, to improve their health span, not just their lifespan, but teaching them how they can best live a life full of vitality and joy regardless of what’s going on, and really giving people control back into their life and empowering them in any way that we can.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:05:44]:
So we were interested in you because we have a special need that we feel like we do some things here at the Riordan Clinic really well. We, we really do a very thorough evaluation of our patients, laboratory wise. We have some very innovative therapies like IV vitamin C and a number of natural therapies. And we work in the natural realm of trying to help patients figure out and correct whatever the underlying causes are. We try to do a pretty good follow up. But what we’ve learned over the years, we have people coming from all over the country, all over the, that our follow up hasn’t been as good as we would like. And so what attracted Me to you in that sense is that you have the ability to communicate with people and have a background of knowledge and that you could possibly be an online connection with people because as time they’ll come here, they’ll have an intensive evaluation, treatment and the follow up in the first few months is good, but after that it kind of wanes and we would like to stay in touch with our patients. And so having someone who could articulate the values of the Riordan approach and have the background that you have in, on, in oncology and, and surgery and also your interest in the whole person, that whole person perspective is a little bit hard to find sometimes. And so how does that sound? Did that. Is that kind of what you understand?

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:07:19]:
Totally resonates with me. I know that it’s very difficult for providers to spend the amount of time necessary to really know the person. And then most people are willing, you know, able to make changes initially in their, their treatment and maybe early in survivorship. But it, you know, we’re human beings and we’re used to certain patterns of being and habits and without person to be touching base with them, to be their cheerleader, to be their accountability buddy, it’s so easy for people to fall back into old ways of being, old patterns and habits that eventually will undermine all the, the progress that they’ve made. So I like to be that person to, to that they feel like they can reach out to if they have something that’s shifted in their world or maybe some things that they don’t want to spend time talking to their provider because there’s other things that you do. So I see that as, as my role is to, to be their, their accountability buddy, their cheerleader, and to help support them long term, not just during the time that they’re actually getting therapies.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:08:34]:
Yeah. And so the, nowadays really, when you get into holistic medicine, natural medicine, there’s a lot to learn. I mean, I have a number of patients that come in and tell me that, you know, that there’s, there’s really not that much information about nutritional medicine. And I pull out my, my nutritional medicine book that is that thick. It’s just that it’s not taught in the medical school that much. And so. But not. And I understand that doctor, you know, what we’re working with here at the Riordan Clinic now is, is an integrative approach because we’ve found that especially with cancer patients, that’s a very complex illness. And we need the best of conventional medicine, but we need the best of integrative medicine as well. So bridging that gap in an educational way, this kind of creates what has been called the survivorship approach. And so what’s your understanding of survivorship?

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:09:34]:
Well, the definition of survivor is really at the time of diagnosis, so at any point in their cancer care continuum. So even if you’ve been disease free for years, you’re still considered a survivor. And I’m not sure that everybody really loves that term. I’ve heard a supplement maybe thrivership.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:09:57]:
But it’s really, I think very important that people have a good quality long term survivorship program to help kind of retrain their mindset, their nutritional choices.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:10:14]:
How they live their life, how they respond, not react to stresses in their world. Help them navigate some of the challenges that may come up periodically, whether that’s with emotional trauma or stress or financial, you know, just to have that network of people within their care team to step in and help them along the way. And it varies for everybody. So one size doesn’t fit all ever in my opinion. And it’s really important to individualize care. And in order to do that individualization of care, you need to spend time to get to know everything about a person and their culture and their background. And that takes a lot of time. And it’s not a quick fix, it’s a process. It’s lifelong learning. And I just love, I love inspiring people to be lifelong learners because so much changes over time. Just with integrative care. There’s so much information and research and data coming out about complementary therapies and nutritional therapies and stress management that is really not a priority for many reasons. It’s not not to criticize, but in conventional medicine there just isn’t the space for that. And they’re not really learning that yet in medical school.

Riordan Clinic [00:11:47]:
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Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:12:44]:
No, I think we’re definitely filling in a gap that’s been there. And, and, and when people do get a serious diagnosis like cancer, then they are hungry for new information. They’re motivated to really try a number of different things. But then as time goes on there can be confusion about well, should I do this, should I continue that? What’s the right nutrient, what’s the best follow up? And I think part of survivorship is when.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:13:15]:
The impact of the initial diagnosis kind of wanes. What do you have to sustain your interest in your health? How can you continue to grow and to take that initial launch.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:13:30]:
Into this whole new world of optimal health?

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:13:36]:
Where can you get a good resource? We’re wanting this program, this survivorship program, we haven’t really named it yet, that you’re going to be heading up is a place where people can come to if they want several times a week and kind of ask questions. So it’s not going to be a one way street. It’s going to be a dynamic feedback so that it will be much like what they call a survivor group. And I know that was big in terms of breast cancer and different types of cancer, that if people had this follow up connection with other people, other patients who were dealing patients and co-learners who were dealing with this same diagnosis or similar diagnosis, if they had that connection with other people, it actually did something good for their immune systems and their, their actual outcomes were improved.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:14:28]:
Absolutely. I mean we know that we are social beings and so community and connection and feeling safe and feeling heard and supported are all very critical for optimal wellness.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:14:43]:
So kind of tell me a little bit more about how you know, you, you, you’re an osteopathic doctor, how did that frame your understanding of medicine? Because I’m, I’m with Dr. Rose here now. I’m kind of learning more about osteopathic medicine and how it has a more holistic foundation.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:15:00]:
Yeah, well, I started out in nursing just as a stepping stone into getting into medicine. And my nursing program was very much holistic based, whole person care. And then both my brother and my are MDs and I chose to go the osteopathic route because of its philosophy and holism. And.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:15:23]:
That just kind of set the wheels in motion for me to inquire more. I’m a very curious person. I’m always asking questions. Sometimes the more we learn, we realize how much we don’t know and that’s still more to learn. So you know, the human experience is, is very complex and it just, it takes a lot to try to unpack and unwrap the, the layers of the onions to really understand for an individual what is going to be best for them, what do they need at this time, which might be different than six months from now, and to keep everything fluid and dynamic. Unfortunately, most of the survivorship programs that I’ve been involved with are based out of big healthcare institutions or academic centers and they’re, but they really just focus on.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:16:20]:
Outlining what a person needs as far as follow up imaging or risk testing, whatever their risk for disease is. And that’s very important. But I would like to see our program infuse more things on helping them learn more strategies for whatever their particular needs are that’s separate from that.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:16:48]:
Interestingly enough, in my medical school training, the only doctor that talked to me about wellness was a surgeon. It was a shock my third year when we, we, I went to a special hospital. It was an outlying hospital and we had four medical students and the surgeon there set us down for our noon conferencing the first time. And we started talking about the importance of exercise and whole foods. And it was like I was a bit shocked. But it, but, but surgeons I found are doers. You know, in medicine there’s a lot of what I call armchair doctors that kind of listen and give a diagnosis and they contemplate all what’s going on. But surgeons are like, okay, let’s get in there and here’s what we need to do to fix this situation. So I think it’s interesting as, as a surgical background that you kind of bring that, let’s go do it type of attitude to wellness and health and holistic care.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:17:45]:
Yeah, I’ve definitely been a doer all my life. Sometimes, although it’s a blessing, I think it can also be a curse because I want to keep doing more and more and more and I have to remind myself to continue to practice what I preach and practice self care and find that balance. So life is all about balance. We talked a little bit about this yesterday.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:18:07]:
And to help people find the balance in their life. And in order to do that, we need to first uncover where there’s deficiencies or excesses or insufficiencies or where there’s opportunity to make improvements on changes that they’ve already made. But I truly believe that, you know, the, the human body is, is just so incredibly miraculous that we can heal with the Right building blocks in the right amounts at the, for the right person. And so that’s a process to uncover.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:18:42]:
Yeah. So health is a doing thing. You know, if you don’t do something, you’re not going to be healthier. But the question is, are you doing the right thing? And, and so Dr. Riordan’s, I think, great.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:18:55]:
Achievement was to create a really expanded measurement system. So when people come to the Riordan Clinic, we, we, it’s a, like a 14 page report of their biochemistry, their nutritional factors, their hormonal factors. And so you get that kind of as a, as a launch pad. But then what do you do with it? That’s the, that’s the really important thing. Do you, do you take a supplement? Do you change your diet? Do you need more exercise? Are there certain IV modalities that should be utilized? What about your thinking? What about, are you sleeping right? How are you getting along with your, your family and your, your important other people? All of these things become doing things that people want to do, but sometimes they need that little bit of coaching or support. And this is what we’re trying to bring to the matter of fact, I thought we had it years ago when we did the lunch and lecture program every Thursday. People would come in, we would have a topic, there was always Q and A, and people would go away feeling empowered. And then the pandemic hit and there went our program. People did not want to come out. And so nowadays we, the other problem is just we all live busy lives. And so if we can do this in a kind of podcast form, but in a two way, I think it’ll, it’ll truly give patients a better opportunity to exercise what they’re learning and to affirm what’s right and change course if it’s not quite the right thing.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:20:27]:
Absolutely. I think that as horrible as the pandemic was, I think the blessing that came out of the pandemic was the ability to reach more people through the power of the Internet. And I have experienced that when people have had the opportunity to learn, learn the why, you know, a lot of times they’ll go to their doctor, say, oh, you need to lose weight or you need to exercise. Well, they’re not really explained what exercise does for the whole body, the whole mind and body and actually the soul. So I feel that.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:21:07]:
The majority of patients that I’ve worked with, if you spend the time to explain the why, they’re more likely to be motivated and excited and charged up to work with their providers to make sustainable, lifelong changes that Even small baby steps, small changes can create great shifts and great outcomes over time.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:21:35]:
So we’re looking forward to having you be a leader in this, this endeavor and to be a kind of focal point that people can come back to as they are exploring their own pathways to better health. And so I’m just thrilled that you’ve accepted the position and that it’s just a matter of time here before we get. We. We kind of evolve from just a. A podcast format to an interactive format. So that will be happening in the next month or so, so we can be announcing that to people. So welcome aboard.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:22:13]:
Well, thank you. I’m very excited to. To be here and to work with all of you.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:22:19]:
Yep. And it’s Dr. Cynthia Aks. AKS.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:22:23]:
Yes.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:22:23]:
Not the hatchet.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:22:24]:
Not the hatchet. Sounds the same as the tool, but spelled different.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:22:28]:
Okay, well, thank you so much.

Cynthia Aks, DO, FACOS, ABIHM [00:22:30]:
Thank you very much.

Riordan Clinic [00:22:33]:
Thank you for listening to the Real Health Podcast. If you enjoy this episode, be sure to subscribe and leave us a review. You can also find all of the episodes and show notes over at realhealthpodcast.org also be sure to visit riordanclinic.org where you will find hundreds of videos and articles to help you create your own version of Real Health.

Ron Hunninghake, MD [00:23:00]:
Sam.